Suggested Infra Build

I’m playing after a long time away and very immediately remember the feeling of “ah shit… what the heck do I build?” I can only imagine how lost new players must feel.

I would like to see about taking the following data to suggest a build for your empire:

  • your empire’s race
  • your empire’s research
  • your current production
  • your projected production (calculated from incoming buildings)
  • your family’s production
  • your family’s projected production (calculated from family’s incoming buildings)
  • a “stability” weight based on how long planets have been owned, so that wartime gains/losses are accounted for when factoring

This would be only a rough suggestion and more experienced players would probably be able to fine-tune their builds to be far more efficient. Similarly, family econ planners would probably do a better job but families who don’t have that luxury won’t be completely without direction.

We definitely need this kind of thing. The most efficient (in my opinion) way to play in a family is to have certain roles within the fam - something we take for granted but new players won’t have a clue.

A new player will join and think “right, I need to create cash so I will build some of that, but then I will need more iron and endu and food and oct so i will build all of that too” and try and balance it all out when realistically, majority of our rounds are fam-based so, should be gearing players up to learn one of the roles I would imagine.

In all reality I do not think a function like this will be much help. The majority of players playing in the fam based galaxies will talk with their fams and know what they need to build, and when to build it. Even new and returning players will typically fall under this umbrella.

Plus your role or what you are building can change multiple times in a round. For rounds with science builds allowed then you typically will build infra that is not for you at all, but is being passed.

Also depending on start strategy you may be building multiple different buildings to get fam infra fixed.

I would also say that later in the round these numbers could be skewed as you take planets from other families that have infra on them that is not part of your current “role”

To me a more useful tool would be 1 or both of the following

  1. a more interactive guide, that shows a lot of surface level items, such as what you mentioned above, but can also go more into detail about certain formulas and such
  2. A full interactive tuturial like you see in a lot of rpg games, show new people how to build, expo, attack, work in a family. Would give them a small idea of game play and also some ideas before they fully start.

Family plans/roles aren’t of much use if the family isn’t active. What I’m describing here is essentially a fallback if nobody is around to help.

This would be particularly useful for new players who land mid-round into a family that stopped playing.

Given that it’s a suggested build, are they any downsides?

The suggestion will be weak and it’s not going to benefit a new player, just make them more of a joke. I recently got into Age of Empires and learnt most of the basics by watching youtube videos. You need some youtube videos made by some real players to entice players to learn how to play the game competitively. There’s no point having a half arsed guide and a suggested build which makes you fail. People want to win.

That’s a fair point about it being a crutch. On the other hand, requiring players to watch YouTube videos to even know how to play seems like a pretty high barrier to entry.

That has me wondering though: for a lot of IC’s history some players have simply taken direction from the family econ planners. By the same logic, many of those people arguably never learned how to play properly either. Yet, many of them still played competitively, especially attackers.

In that regard, what’s the difference between a family member suggesting to a new player what to build vs the game doing so? In both cases the player is simply following a build plan they didn’t come up with on their own.

I feel like you just took your first step to understanding this game Pie. You are exactly right, I doubt 10% of all IC players past and present actually read the guide on how to play. So the majority of learnings is peer to peer based which is why you have such varying degrees of skills and competency in the game. I think thats what makes IC quite unique though, that a player who considers themselves well learned can join a family and realise that what they know is all crap.

So maybe what you are suggesting isn’t so bad, especially with less active families.

Well, the “first step” there is hardly an epiphany; anybody who’s ever specialized in attacking already knows this. It’s been that way for as long as there have been roles.

The question here is more of the impact of effectively having an AI planner where none is otherwise present.

In any case, I don’t think this will be on the list anytime soon. I more wanted to just get it down so I don’t forget it, and for feedback. Thank you @Funeral @MTG_Dad and @OrBit for your perspective.

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I would say Orbit that Age2 is the best template for what we should do. Age is all about the build orders, and learning them, at least for the start. Then learning to adapt to what comes your way, learning how to spot what build your opponent is doing, and how to counter it.

It would be awesome to have a series of Build Orders and fam structure for IC, with general strategy around each and what might counter it (in terms of getting some sort of edge).

It is a little harder because there is no tactics in IC only strategy, and that is long term and human to human, no numbers to crunch too much… but still first 96 ticks could be mapped out

As it is now and always has been a returning or new player must rely on being taught by there family or a dedicated player willing to help them along the way.
Everyone has always been looking for a proper guide or even faq to help along the way and we rely on old pages that may no longer be up to date.
Right now by far they best advantage a player can take to learning is searching the forum as they would a Google search. Many many players have discussed this over the years and shared very useful information that should be collected and placed into a pined area. I will share the few links I direct people to right now but this stuff only really helps you if you understand it.

My suggestion to fix most of this would be a speed galaxy but I know that needs a whole new server. Players learning at 1 min tick speed can easily try something then restart and try again learning the ropes a lot faster but this would not help with the attacking aspect of the game.

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Mapping out certain ticks only works depending on the family and strategies. I would argue there are many tactics to ic and is why some do better then others.
The main advantage goes to players who are good at math this should be taken away with in-game calculations to help others strategies better. Players who can calculate days in advance are more likely to do better then someone who goes day by day.
Tactics come into play during war times and can even the score.

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Hmm I agree with cells on this one.