Well i dunno about anyone else opinion but i think Mw57 is done already… the results are in and the summary of the round is pretty simple… Due to a weak leader that was selected (darrk) who led a stir of intra fam fighting… left his fam and took his gf with him… 01 and 02 fight was pretty much 1 on 1 and 02 lost and their next leader (pie) signs the dumbest NAP in IC history but eh whateva… then 01 and 02 2v1 for almost 2weeks nobody wants to NAP its already clear here 01 is the winner congrats… due to 02 not wanting to NAP and dont wanna be bored i can understand sorta… 01 dont wanna NAP cause we’d kill 02 and they would lose their pcount lead… its pretty much a clear cut win for 01… not mad or salty just disappointed i thought this was to be a triple threat round were we are all fighting each other but instead we got a 2v1 for 2weeks and they blame it on poor diplo skills. how is it poor diplo skills if i dont wanna NAP anyone cause its only 3 fucking families in the gal lol smh. its just i figured this was to be a triple threat not a 2v1 lol… anyway rounds pretty much done 01 is gonna most likely win… 00 cannot fight 39 players at once… 18 on 39 just doesnt work.
Alrighty, here’s a more serious take on this.
I will say this round has proved far more interesting than I anticipated. For the sake of posterity, here’s my perspective:
Our intra-fam fighting wasn’t lead by darrk, but he was a main factor in it. In his defense, I don’t think he was actively instigating anything. It was more of a negative response to some decisions he was making and a challenge to his authority.
He did leave though, and yes his GF was also around less as a result. We hoped for his return but after awhile it became apparent that he was done so we declared him inactive and cleared him out.
This is not accurate. When we (02) and 01 came to the table for peace talks, we are already fighting off both families. This was not a 1 on 1 between 02 and 01. For all ICD’s complaints about 2v1 against his family, he wasn’t complaining when he was participating in and benefiting from the same thing against our family.
And you know what? I don’t blame anybody for hitting us at the time, 2v1 or otherwise. Our internal issues made us an easy target and both other families saw the opportunity to benefit. Why wouldn’t they?
So suck it up ICD. We did.
So, while actively being hit by both families, we got our shit together which was a pretty painful process for all of us involved. But we worked through it and realized we needed to lean on diplomacy if we wanted any chance of surviving the round.
So we (shout out to our VLs) put some feelers out to both 01 and 02 to discuss possible peace. That’s where this comes in:
01 offered us a deal, and we took it. This deal puts 00 at a disadvantage, so of course they don’t like it.
We did however, also attempt peace with ICD/00:
This is completely false. We repeatedly approached 00 with peace. ICD suggested a deal in which we give up an entire system for peace, and we counter-offered suggesting a trade instead:
I_like_pie - 09/21/2017
fam doesn’t wanna give up 22,68
we don’t gain anything by doing that and many of them are fine to keep fighting
we’re open to trading out other systems though
they’re willing to let you guys have 21,61 if we keep 22,68 and you guys drop out of 140,135 (1 planet)
it’s an even trade, and less work for both of us
In response to this, ICD told us that we wouldn’t keep either system anyway, and that we hold no ground, and that ICD would raid our bankers. To this, I tried to warn ICD about the long term impact of taking such a hard stance:
I_like_pie - 09/21/2017
even if that is true, the hassle here is us being a distraction for you
ICD told me that he’d “just make peace with 01”.
So this 2v1 whining is a joke, and us not wanting a NAP is a flat out lie. ICD could have avoided all of this if his ego didn’t get in the way of a very reasonable peace offering. Instead, he decided that he would just make peace with 01 and raid our bankers.
Well, it didn’t turn out that way.
This is true, and shows that 01’s leadership knows how to strategize. I can’t say the same for 00.
This isn’t what we were hearing during our family’s internal struggles. At that time people were telling us that our round was over and that we’ve already lost and were self destructing.
It’s funny how the story changes once we actually prove that we’re still a threat.
If you don’t want to NAP anybody, that is fine. But this is the result. If you had agreed to peace with us it would have been a 1v1 fight against 00 and 01.
You don’t want a 2v1 but you also don’t want to NAP anybody. You can’t have it both ways. 01 understood this, as did my family.
Then perhaps you should have been more open to our initial peace talks. You brought this situation onto yourself; don’t blame others for you not being open to NAP talks. That’s your decision, not anybody else’s.
If only someone had tried to point out that a small number of big families would end up being terrible for at least 1/3 of the galaxy:stuck_out_tongue:
As the owner of the game, @I_like_pie is in a weird situation here. If he signs a NAP with 00 it’s bad for his family. At this point why in the world would they do it? 01 is doing all the heavy lifting and they’re able to pick up scraps while boosting their eco like mad. If he doesn’t sign the NAP it’s bad for the game, because for a big chunk of 00 this round has been terrible and I’ll be really surprised if we all return. Fair or not, this is the owner of the game actively preventing 2 competitive families from having any real possibility of competing. Yes it started because @IC_Death death has an ego the size of Montana and chose not to negotiate, but that initial response makes the game look bad. Playing publicly when you’re in a position that should by all accounts be unbiased is hard. We all know @IC_Death calls for a round to end every time it turns sour for him or he personally gets bored, I bet if you check the old forums there are at least a dozen polls he started asking to end the round…but imo, again fair or not, @I_like_pie needs to be more mature and remember that he’s asking these players to support him.
That’s a fair point, but it’s also a pretty ridiculous double standard. You seem to be aware of that, and I’m guessing you experienced similar issues during your time as a Moderator. In fact, I know you have.
This reminds me of that UA round where you pissed off Tsunami by publicly requesting special ops. He did quit the game as a direct result, but your actions as a player that lead to a reduction in our playerbase shouldn’t be held against you as a staff member who’s job was to retain/increase our playerbase. I believe this situation is very similar.
You’re spot on though, as a player, the competition puts me in a situation where I inevitably piss off other players while also as the owner asking them to become Patreon subscribers. It’s a very unusual position and something I knew would be tricky to walk into.
Most players can handle the distinction and don’t take things personally. Others, well… our community has its share of egos.
4400 is in a shitty spot right now, and ICD is turning on baby mode. I’ve decided to call him out on his bullshit and yes, mock him for saying “not mad or salty” and then proceeding to exhibit his saltiness instead of owning up to the fact that he is at least partially responsible for diplomacy failures.
For better or for worse, I still have a player’s spirit it me. If other players act like chumps I’m not above calling them out for it.
As for this:
I do remember that I’m asking for everybody’s support, but I’d rather play this game honestly than compromise my choices because I’m afraid of losing subscribers. Integrity means more to me than money.
I can understand your point but I don’t agree with it. It might make better business sense for me to “play nice”, but so would throwing ads on the site or adding p2w features.
My loyalty to my family trumps my desire for subscribers. I’d rather lose money by being a good leader and teammate than gain money by being a pushover.
If nothing else, the community can know that I’m not changing how I play because money is involved. “IC sold out to its Subscribers” is not something I anticipate hearing anytime soon.
You’re falling into the same logic trap as ICD. The setup here isn’t the problem, it’s his unwillingness to NAP under any circumstances. A “classic” style 1v1 battle between 00 and 01 was possible, but ICD chose against it.
Original idea for this round was 1 vs 1 giant fams. Personally i would have liked 2 or 4 fams netter.
@IC_Death we could have napped, just not with and even systems count like you proposed. Your proposal was very disadvantageous for us considering the current rate we gain planets.
The one system muppets requested seems very reasonable to get a 1 vs 1 with us.
Oh, yea it’s totally unfair to hold you to a higher standard. You’re in an awful situation, and I’m being a hypocritical asshat, but I also had much less at stake
we 02 had to do something or everyone would have quit. we made a nap and atleast we can have a round out of it now. We were 2v1 for the whole beginning while we were wasting all our time on useless intra fam problems. I think we brought the 2v1 on a bit ourselves from what i saw. not an attacker so don’t know forsure but seems like we got to greedy with the map.
how am i on a ego trip… u know pitbull he doesnt like pointless NAPS what purpose would we NAP for no reason just to suite ur comfort… makes no sense to me… u call it poor diplomacy but how? cause i didnt show hostile aggressive towards a fam but they wanted a NAP to feel safe… shit its 3 fams in a gal… thats dumb if i NAPPED u we would of gained nothin from it… i didnt expect u guys would 2v1 but i guess so… call that strategy or whateva but we wasnt opping ur bankers and etc when this all started it was u guys while 01 raided us and we radied them u were raiding us and doing ops on our bankers… so the poor diplomacy thingy doesnt make sense… it doesnt hold up at all…
It’s not that awful tbh. Frustrating sure, but like everything else there are lessons to be learned here.
ICD, a NAP with us would have secured a 1v1 fight between you guys and 01. It’s a strategic consideration, and would hardly be pointless. It’s fine if you guys didn’t want to, that’s your choice. But in doing so you secured a 2v1.
1v1 between 00 and 01 was possible this round. It was staring you right in the face. You chose against it and now your family is feeling battle fatigue. This is the consequence of your decisions as the leader.
It’s not a shot at you personally dude, but that’s objectively poor strategy given your situation at the time. It was bad diplomacy because you had so much to gain from it for very little cost but you have too much pride to accept a fair deal.
Put it this way: if I also said “no NAPS” then my family would have been toast. We were in a situation where accepting a NAP with 01 was strategically advantageous. It sucks that we had to eat our pride and give them some planets, but our fam’s long term benefit is worth more than our short term pride.
I can respect you not wanting to NAP, but it does come with consequences. What I don’t respect is not owning up to the effects of that decision.
The galaxy setup is an excuse. You could have had 1v1, all you had to do was accept our NAP offer. The round would have been almost entirely 1v1 while 02 saved up for an EoR battle against you guys.
How does that not make sense?
u dumbshit next time if u want peace for half the fucking round why dont u make the shit that way to meet ur sorry ass requirements… u are a shit player and crappy leader and a pure idiot when it comes just simple respect… because i didnt want to NAP i bring on a 2v1 good job good job dumbass… u crap ur a idiot and u should of never been placed as leader nor stepped up to take the mantle dumbass no wonder no one likes u
You’re right, you clearly don’t have any issues with your diplomacy skills.
Anyway, I tried using reason here to explain why the NAP wouldn’t have been pointless. It seems you’re not interested in hearing other perspectives.
To the rest of 00, none of this is personal. You can see above what I’ve been dealing with when I try to talk peace with you guys.
when 02 was getting 2v1 we were in last place and way behind and would of napped either fam or both. now its our fault that we got ourselves out of a 2v1 and placed in on you? no its your fault death so stop your acting like a fool which happens every round when you don’t get your way. I like you man but you have to stop complaining.