Restore the old limit on spells and ops

Players used to be limited to 7 Spell or Op actions, after which they who would regain 1 per tick. This limit was supposed to return when the failed morale rewrite was reverted, but it never got prioritized.

Oppers have become overpowered as a result, which has lead to an imbalance. We will be restoring the old limit.

When this happens, players in any active galaxies will gain an evolution to adjust their strategy and family plan as necessary.

3 Likes

If anything this just under powers bankers and gives no reason for attackers to think twice before hitting a target again.

Due to the recent change where the racial attack stat was now taken into account during defense as well, this puts any would be banker in a huge disadvantage as casting was the only viable offensive option, and the only offensive actions that will be viable now will be with 50% attack racial bonus. We return to the age of bankers being mandatory, and doing nothing but aid in once infra has been stacked.

Personally I like the fact a banker could cast someone into surrender and obtain their planets though this kind of offensive action, rather than having to send fleets. I don’t think the issue was with the system, rather the morale costs for spells need to change depending on the variables like it does with standard attacking.

Well, that’s my two cents. I don’t know if it matters much but I am not happy with this decision. If you can’t pop kill TIF while he funds his buddies and sits at the top of a mountain of cash without the whole game changing because of it what can you do?

3 Likes
  • Good idea
  • Bad idea

0 voters

2 Likes

That should be reverted back as well, but that would be a separate topic.

Dislike.

Adjust morale for ops if needed, either based on empire size or just a set amount for different types of ops but in Infinitum this really hurts banking people more

I don’t like getting 20 x kill scientists but no different than being attacked 20 x and having to build fleet for defense

4 Likes

@I_like_pie see that vote? you can’t ignore those results man

I agree with you 100%, thank you!

Well…

In all honesty it hasn’t been up long.

Give it time :stuck_out_tongue:

1 Like

I am impatient, ADHD!!!

Have I missed another discussion somewhere? This seems to be the logical solution… is it possible to adjust the formula to be like attack morale loss and base it on empire size?

Attack success or failure on any given planet relates to it’s available defence so the morale system works well enough for small empire against large or vice versa.

If a small empire with a small number of agents or wizards attempts to op a much larger empire with a large number of whatever then most, if not all, attempts will fail. There’s no harm in letting them try 50 in a row at 2% loss per if they wish. If a large empire ops a small one it’s almost guaranteed they will succeed every time. If they lose 20% or more morale per op they have a fairer limit than the old fixed number system. It’d take more than just the next tick to be able to do another. Similar sized empires would still be fairly matched.

2 Likes

Yes, you have. This began as a debate about Partaxians being considered overpowered by some in the #think-tank forum.

Interesting discussion.

My question and suggestion still stand then.

Empire size based op limits using an adjusted morale formula would be balanced, more than the old fixed number system could be.

1 Like

Brilliant idea to revert.

I wasn’t here when it was changed and don’t know the philosophy behind it. But I think this change has led to some imbalance like mentioned.

Is the system perfect? Probably not. But it was working.

I agree that a revert will be the first step. Then later we can always think about how to optimise it. (eg. Give people 10 Ops, but hard Ops cost 2 and soft ops 1).

Plus I’m always favour in changing stuff, and if it doesn’t work as intended, be confident to change back or tweak as necessary :+1:t3:

1 Like

I dont know much about this, but I think you are mixing issues here. Opping someone to oblivion is not supposed to be possible in a ‘normal’ gal. They have ‘hardcore’ galaxy settings for that without morale and Op limits. In a Normal galaxy, the intention was to provide safeguards against this. Eg:

  • Morale Limits
  • Op limits
  • Networth protection (I.e. 25% blow up rule)
  • Protection Mode (pmode - albeit not always working properly)

And regarding someone just banking and funding others, we’ll that’s also a feature of the galaxy. You have UA and alliances or whatever and people are to work as they are.

If you Restore old limit of ops means you have to restore limits on finding morale planets aswell.

I remember back in the days as an attacker i used to instantly ejaculate when i found a morale planet. Now ejaculation seems so boring!
Oh i meant finding a morale planet! :joy::rofl:

1 Like

Pretty certain that there is a limit on how much morale can be regained in a single tick. As far as the plethora of morale planets littering the galaxies, yeah, that is a bit out of hand and has been suggested that it be lowered by quite a bit.

I get where you are coming from, really wasn’t expecting a sudden change that would impact existing conflict and think any change should be after current conflict as you have a strat based on existing mechanics that would be impacted.

But I don’t think outside a hardcore galaxy that you should be able to throw so many ops and do that much damage to a single player in such a short timeframe, it indicates a balance issue and that issue is across all hard ops.

Lastly offtopic, I’ve just been playing my own econ game with little interest in the conflicts and have only funded vicious in the alliance mostly to build all the food I needed but also to get some planets for more growth.

2 Likes

Good points on all sides!

@TheBigOne I especially enjoy the straight forward Good Idea, Bad Idea poll choices. :slight_smile:

Speaking of polls:

It is helpful, yes. In general though discussion will carry far more weight than the polls, so let’s encourage others to explain their choice as well. :slight_smile:

I’ve removed this from the #to-do list for now, but we really should consider this point:

@Vindi and @Daffy have suggested a Variable Spell and Op morale cost type change in which an ops’ cost is also dependent on size. That’s a reasonable sounding compromise. :thinking:

2 Likes

Imho morale based opps are better.

  • Early game (when impact is biggest) you can do less opps (4 at 25% morale cost) than with the original morale system (7 ops).
  • Synergy with declaring war. Less morale cost, more ops
  • Morale competes with attacks. Having a separate counter will I increase offense even more. Those very active oppers will now also be doing retakes on top.
  • Diversification in strategies. I like that a pax can actually halt an opponent from progressing in a war - Desyroy pop banker, kill main attacker science, herrass iron stock. If you haven’t thought of that as attacking fam than you don’t deserve to win.
2 Likes

Woo hoo! That is a victory in my books! Back to patrion. My strike is over.