Partaxians Overpowered ... How to Fix?

I’ve seen multiple instances of players stating the Partaxians are way overpowered nowadays. Assuming this is simply the result of spec ops being morale based. Short of reverting that back, what other ideas do people have for bringing Partaxians back down to the other races?

Take away the magic, Harry

I think the part that makes them strong is the ability to bank and the race change that was added this year. Perhaps give them a negative income and/or pop bonus to compensate.

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I think the main issue with partax is just the ops/spells themselves have been put out of balanced by switching to morale allowing to many to be cast by one person.
This has been made worse with recent changes to allow UA, now a single opper can be funded by an even larger group of players.
Lastly the magic bonus of partax seems a little to high.

Ops are very powerful and almost impossible to defend against if you have similar or smaller econ, if your much much larger then it is possible.

Ops don’t have a travel time and can be used the same tick the wizards/agents are built, so the they really need to be balanced around how much initial damage they can do, so can either limit number of ops or adjust the damage the op does do.

In general being able to wipe someone out before they have a chance to react is a bad mechanic.

The initial damage needs to be balance so as to give the defending party time to respond before they have been wiped out.
22 nukes/estorms/hynos/kill science/kill iron/GC all do too much initial damage with current numbers.

The “simple” solution would be to restore the previous mechanic were it was pretty close to being balanced for most of the hard ops. (Estorm possibly still op killing 99% pop - three day recovery time before chance to respond)

The more complex solutions i can think of are:
Adjust morale cost of ops (cost of 10-14 moral gets back to 7 initial ops, but then is only 1 every other tick)
Add a travel time for ops possibly with a warning
Adjust power of ops - say to 40% of current damage and 40% of current cost to use

Example of adjusting power to get closer to previous balance.
Nuke:
Old system
15% time 7 + 1 per tick (total of 105% + 15% per tick damage to a single building type)
Now
15% times 22 + 1-2 per tick (total of 330% + 15-30% per tick to single building type)
Adjusted
change nuke to do 6%, reduce casting cost by 40% (total 132 + 6-12)
Side effect more of making ops less powerful is a greater loss to failures as you will have to cast more often.

Restoring previous mechanic or changed morale costs seems the simplest solutions.

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This is very well stated. The first part’s been true for awhile but agreed the UA thing has made it much worse.

I’ve added Restore the old limit on spells and ops to the #to-do list. This is relatively small enough of a concept that I’d like to prioritize it above other changes.

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So we keep the defensive add on to the attack racial stat and gimp casters to the point they are useless because someone fucked your pop up while you funded attackers basically? This is our offense, we don’t have the ability to take planets by force now as the defense of the attackers is so damn high and we destroy the economy of the enemy. The simplest solution is build more damn wizards for defense.

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Harks can hand out a beating with fleets but can’t take one with spells eh?

My original post predates the conflict you mention. And this situation with Partaxians has been mentioned many times by others just since I returned last year.

A good counter-perspective @RenegadeDamon!

Curious as to others’ thoughts here. @team?

I put up a long post on your to-do, this change honestly is infuriating enough to have me drop patron until it’s reversed. There may be an argument to be had to look at the morale cost fluctuating as it does with attackers but going back to 7 max with 1 added a tick is taking our ability away to fight.

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I can’t avoid you having attacking/defensive bonuses and can’t win in a fleet battle, just as you can;t avoid my magic bonus and wiz fleet. This makes the game one sided and broken.

In games many op things either get nerfed so other things become op. Or in a game like Dota things just get buffed so there is many op things. The way the ops work now is way stronger than they used to be ,but it causes things to be way more riskier. I am not currently in infil ,but in regular gals protecting your bankers from ops is a serious concern and it should be. Risk vs reward to war or not to war. Can you negoiate a nap cancel war with certain ops disabled if you feel like you are weaker in that area.

If you use these ops fams take it very serious in Mw at least. In infil yeh your gonna be down awhile ,but hey you have 98.5 years to recover.

I can understand the frustration, but fwiw I don’t plan to ever let players dictate features through their donations.

We can and should question these things and debate them, but money won’t have any influence one way or another.

@I_like_pie I can respect that, however this change isn’t like most others you would normally do, this breaks the game. The only way you could do this without is breaking the game is to remove the recently added defense bonus to the racial attack stat so we could at least attack again and have a chance. This destroys a portion of the game and makes it extremely one sided. This is an even bigger problem given there is a SS perma gal currently with SS being broken and this all started because the dominant group in that gal handed everyone their asses (not complaining about that, they played well, good job) and we retaliated with the one weak spot they had, not enough spell defense. I should add the amount of fails were enormous and the wizard losses huge so it didn’t go without loss.

This needs to be revisited before anything is done.

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So do we go back to attack being the only offensive option in a strategy game? Seems kinda stale no?

and what happens to the guys who carry a few mill wiz and low fleets when you make this change, now every attacker can just pounce on em. He doesn’t have enough spells to go around to be a threat, so screw that guy and is he going to get reimbursed for those wizards? No he isn’t so now he has to disband a useless fleet of wizards which would have once struck fear into Terror here losing his science (and he did make sure he didn’t want me hitting his sci) to now going okay, time to just mess em all up and they can’t touch me, good luck getting through that defense bonus.

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pretty sure the defense bonus is not anything new. the attack formula been broken for a long time. not a feature.

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Hate getting off on a tangent, but what are you talking about? MOO is by far the largest group in that galaxy. Your membership is 2.5x to 3x larger than PiP and the other group you are referring to is not even an alliance in the traditional sense.

I agree that a race attack bonus should not count on defense. Between that and ops being morale based now it seems to have devolved into a situation where:

a) A Wardancer’s fleet is nearly invulnerable to anyone other than another Wardancer.
b) A Partaxian can cast spells at will except for against another larger Partaxian.

But the deeper down the rabbit hole this discussion is taken, the more off topic and complicated it all becomes. i.e. do we neuter Partaxians and Wardancers or increase advantages of the other races?

As I pointed out earlier, this discussion is not about any specific conflict, but an observation across months about how much stronger Partaxians are nowadays than they were just a few years ago.

Which is why I did state if you are going to do this change, the defense issue needs to be addressed along with it. By only changing the op amount and nothing else you break this portion of the game, and frankly I don’t think it’s broken. The morale cost needs to be adjusted so that it fluctuates sure! You shouldn’t be able to cast insane amounts on a smaller guy than you at 5% each cast, but given the failure rate and bigger dudes will have more defense means if you got 7 chances to hit the number of ops you need to hit a few fails breaks your ability to be effective at all. You then also can;t attack with no attack bonus and have no defense so why even exist?

You do realize that Quantum does not have an attack bonus either. Not negative sure, but not positive either,

It has been a LONG time, but as I recall, the races have changed a lot over the years. Quantum used to have an attack bonus and ability to cast No Fear (I think). Not anymore. Wardancers seem to have been buffed up as have Partaxians. The rest I don’t really have a clue as I don’t think I ever played a serious round with any of them.

No, they use that massive sci bonus, the point it, removing the ability for bankers to cast as an offensive action gives attackers no need to think of consequences before hitting them. Hell even rev’s can nuke and hypno. If you want to limit spells to a fixed number, then attacking should be done in this manner too to balance the roles.